Go to https://buyraycon.com/addyopen
to get 20% off. Thanks to Raycon for sponsoring!

the 'sexulization' part really got me so i wanted to write something.
im a minor right now, not gonan tell my age.
i am in the 2020 alt kid- like subculture and ive been wearing it alot for a long time (about 3 years now).
i had this guy in my class, he sits next to me, we were talking in class about a tv show he watched and he was talking about how hot she was, i just laughed at it. the next class, he hooks his finger under my fishnets and says these exact words; 'damn i do picture you diffrently when youre wearing these, youre hotter.'
i was stunned with shock and disgust, after that class i went with my friend to the bathroom and straight up cried.
i was in second of middle school at the moment, i always wore those fishnets.
after that i started wearing long jeans and a hoodie for 3 months and never spoke to him again.


Edit : this was a while ago, I am now dressing that way again and reported him!

Something that isn't even related to the goth aspect of it that I've also had issue with, is their whole bit of straight up cosplaying low income/minimum wage workers.. and the. Fetishizing that as well, especially with it being quite known that they make a very good amount of money. Money that a worker at Dunkin donuts or McDonald's will never see. These fast food minimum wage jobs are quite hard jobs, you often have to deal with daily harassment and long hours without even making enough money to sit on the poverty line.
That I think is the most gross personally.

Knew a guy that unironically said "goth mommy" and everytime I heard it I think my soul fragmented.

they ain’t even goth just got black hair and black lipstick

I love how much empathy addy really has bc ive seen some others talk about this subject and they never really touch on the humanizited side of these adult work women since so many other  people do just see it from the picture what is presented and not whats behind it all and then degrade and bully these women for making this kind of work. Love ur content, Addy!

as someone who interacts with a lot of goth and alternative fashion content, getting bombarded with borderline sexual and fetish content is so exhausting and im sick of it. obviously dealing with this online is completely different to dealing this with real life - ive had friends who do dress more gothic (i dont due to sensory and gender issues rip) mention getting harassed fairly regularly. this popularisation and normalisation of seeing this aesthetic as sexual online only makes it worse, making getting into this culture gradually more dangerous for new people (especially minors).

this makes me so annoyed because the whole point of the goth and punk movement is to defy societal expectations and make a statement, just to be minimised and laughed at by simplifying these people to sexual objects. its just that deep rooted societal misogyny coming up again and again and im sick of explaining it to people. i could go on but ill save it for another time.

thank you addy for this great video, i always appreciate how much time you put into the research and comprehensiveness of your scripts <3333

*clarification: being sexual isnt inherently wrong or the problem as such, its the fact that people are now using it for clout and promotional purposes, and therefore diluting the purpose and foundational ideas of being goth/alternative, if that makes sense

Stay safe Addy! Hope that heatwave isn't causing you too much trouble...

I loved ItaBlackFridays reaction to the goth dating video. While she wasn't disrespectful to the girls involved she offered insight to why for  people genuinely invested in the subculture could be negatively impacted by some of these "goths" and was more horrified by the over sexualising that each girl presented while appearing to wear goth clothing like a costume.

59:04 it's sad that ppl now have to emphasize that just because they disagree with someone, that doesn't mean that they want them to be harassed and doesn't mean that they disagree with their entire existence. People can just disagree on a few things and move on. I also really appreciated the whole "everyone here is a real person" spiel. Everyone deserves a baseline of human respect, and it feels like I'm going insane both online and irl when ppl are so suddenly cruel to someone that they don't know.

We’ve always had tourists. People who show up to the clubs looking for a thrill or to oogle. At one Goth club I frequented we had regulars that wore less than traditional clothing and had live BDSM displays people could sign up for and participate in.
That lead to a lot of Bachelorette parties showing up to “get their freak on” before the big day. And I started attending in ‘99, so…this is not new.
That said, if people want to meet goth folks, again as was stated, show up, hang out, “lurk and learn” as they used to say, but know, we are not very welcoming of people who want to force morality or typical gender roles, and if you are looking for someone to take over for your mommy, most women and men in the space are disinterested in raising a 21+ child who never learned to live on his own.

I unfortunately been affected by this. I am a minor who is alternative and I have been barked at, followed, told to that I must be freaky and much more. It’s all been from men who I assume watch nsfw content of goth women and think all alt fem presenting people are like this

Continuously asked if I’m a goth dommy mommy… I’m transmasc, which yes I look feminine presenting sometimes but I do not hide I am trans, I tell people my pronouns straight up.

My navy trench coat i got bullied for because it was “school sh**ter looking” when i was wearing it in a superwholock way :’)

third eye does in fact still smell like spice and weed 😭

i havent watched this vid yet (no one has) but i rlly hate how in #goth the top videos are "goth mommy" videos

I'm 35 and grew up in a goth and metal head house hold. I grew up with Elvira at a very young age. I think you should really look into the character of Elvira a little bit more and also the actor Cassandra Peterson. She is a comedian at the root of it all. So I don't think the compassion of what's going on is fair. Yes, dresses sexy, but she never allows herself to be treated like an object for men. The first scene in the first movie is her going off on a higher up that she works for because he just assumes she'll sleep with him. She freaks out because he grabs her. Causing a scene on live television, in turn losing her job. Later, when she goes to the small town, her great aunt lives in the sexual harassment happened again with the realtor, and she stands up for herself again. Also when she goes to the bowling alley and gets in a fight with 2 horrible men. She ends up being friends with the one guy who respects her and the kids because she supports who they want to be, and they don't judge her. The whole point of how she acts is making fun of herself because she knows how people think. But, she still respects herself and doesn't take shit from horrible people. That's why most of us die hards love her and probably why my dad let me watch her suff at a really young age. Also the reason the beer t-shirts are a thing is because she was the first character to actually promote alcohol besides a mascot or sports team. There is way more to her character and also her as an artist. I don't think it's fair to use her as a comparison to what's going on now with things like this video everyone is reacting to. Because the character of Elvira and also the actor would never stand to be talked to that way.
Sorry for the rant, I just feel that some of this should know if people only know the face value of the character. This is not to mention Cassandra, who plays her. She herself is queer and an advocate for many important things like the LGBT+ community, woman's rights and so much more. Also her character that her and her male gay friend came up with the look of a "punk Morticia" with elements of different ethnic clutters like her beehive hair from the singer Ronnie Spector. Once again I'm sorry. I'm just trying to educate for whoever doesn't know. I  just don't think it's fair to use her as just as an example of catering to the "male gaze" and how that goes with what people are complaining about how it's being used now, "but we all love her". I just feel there's more to it and more context should be shown. Also isn't that what most of us have been fighting against? Tha should be able to dress and be who we want without being hassled or it assumed that we're a certain way.
I don't think most these men are "normal" people under what the difference is with this. There's a difference between a sw cosplaying as goth or alternative, leaning into stereotypes to sell a fantasy. And a alternative person who does sw. SW, bondage, etc has always been apart of alternative subculture. And even if some if these woman are alternative playing into these stereotypes can be and are hurtful. Once again I don't think "normal" see this that way or care.
Also I'm glad you called out Jake lol. As someone who used to follow him because of Kaya for years...... this is all absolutely true. He's doing the things he does now to make money and it pathetic. I'm so glad yoy talk about all these points in this video.
Also having an opinion about what's going on in the video and how theses girls are leaning into these stereotypes to sell a fantasy..... doesn't make yoy anti sw. These are just things that need to be discussed

I am currently over 40 years old in the U.S, and was always the "goth kid" even when the only store I had access to was Walmart to buy black shirts/pants. Going to the nearest city was a once a year event and I rarely could afford the clothes from hot topic; so I ended up making my own little arm warmers and chokers to fit what felt more like me. Until I graduated. internet was not as big of thing, but even back then I remember adult men approaching me if I wore black lipstick and making remarks about what time I worked at the BDSM shop, leaving black stains on them (From the lipstick) and other derogatory comments I was appalled by. Honestly though, I think there is a fetish culture everywhere, from cheerleaders to trad wives, to alt/goth, certain body shapes etc. If there's a way to profit off of it, people will seek it out (Sometimes just to keep food on the table, or sometimes to make sure they never have that worry). It does bug me when either A) someone is adamant this is their fulltime personality but are only using it for cosplay, and B) When they post for the adult audience, they do not age gate.
If my child wants to see these beautiful people in goth wear, that's great; but when it turns into an exaggerated, boob bouncing, ahegao face for someone's pleasure, I get annoyed.

Ugh thank you for speaking about this addy, I’m sick of men seeing women as nothing but fantasies for them, it hurts minors like me who have been catcalled by men due to their alternative styles, also thanks for the history of goth, that was very interesting

Regarding the Elvira discussion, yes there are similarities but I think that Elvira presenting the way she does is done regardless of public reception, and it speaks to a broader lifestyle. The fact that she likes to show off her figure is just another part of her character/personality. Its a valid criticism that she likely contributed to sexualization of goth and alternative women in particular, but she did it because SHE wanted to and felt like herself by presenting this way. The modern "goth influencers" have often openly admitted that they only took on the aesthetic in order to profit off of the fetishization of the subculture. Its not them expressing themselves or being involved in the community in any way besides the most bare bones version of the aesthetic. You obviously can't always judge the intent or genuineness of someone online just by what they post but when they literally speak out and admit to what theyre doing.... yeah I'll be judging them