Should you learn Ecclesiastical or Classical Latin? This is a question I am often asked, and it's worth exploring in detail. Related questions include: Is Classical Latin superior to Ecclesiastical Latin? Is Ecclesiastical the same as Mediaeval Latin? Where did the Ecclesiastical Pronunciation come from? Is Ecclesiastical Pronunciation the same as Vulgar Latin? This and more will be answered in this heated debate from the streets of Rome! 🏛️
Take my course LATIN UNCOVERED on StoryLearning, including my original Latin adventure novella "Vir Petasātus" :
https://storylearning.com/PolymathyLuke ⬅️
SEE SOURCES BELOW
Note: the "accents" I am using here in English are merely exaggerated caricatures of a British-type accent and a New York-type accent, but are not attempts at authentic representations of either, and I used for comic purposes only.
🦂 Support my work on Patreon:
Patreon: LukeRanieri
📚 Luke Ranieri Audiobooks:
https://luke-ranieri.myshopify.com
🤠 Take my course LATIN UNCOVERED on StoryLearning, including my original Latin adventure novella "Vir Petasātus"
https://learn.storylearning.com/lu-pr...
🦂 Sign up for my Latin Pronunciation & Conversation series on Patreon:
Patreon: 54058196
☕️ Support my work with PayPal:
https://paypal.me/lukeranieri
Consider joining this channel:
@polymathy_luke
🏛 Latin by the Ranieri-Dowling Method: https://luke-ranieri.myshopify.com/co...
🏺Ancient Greek by the Ranieri-Dowling Method: https://luke-ranieri.myshopify.com/co...
🏛 Ancient Greek in Action · Free Greek Lessons:
Ancient Greek in Action! Ancient Greek Les...
🦂 ScorpioMartianus (my channel for content in Latin, Ancient Greek, & Ancient Egyptian)
scorpiomartianus
🎙 Hundreds of hours of Latin & Greek audio:
https://lukeranieri.com/audio
🌍 polýMATHY website:
http://lukeranieri.com/polymathy/
🌅 polýMATHY on Instagram:
Instagram: lukeranieri
🦁 Legio XIII Latin Language Podcast:
legioxiii
👕 Merch:
https://teespring.com/stores/scorpiom...
🦂 https://www.ScorpioMartianus.com
🦅 https://www.LukeRanieri.com
📖 My book Ranieri Reverse Recall on Amazon:
http://amzn.to/2nVUfqd
Intro and outro music: Overture of Die Zauberflöte (The Magic Flute) by Mozart
#latin #linguistics #debate
SOURCES
Vox Latina, by W. Sidney Allen
https://amzn.to/3WdPxSY
The Pronunciation of Greek and Latin, Edgar Howard Sturtevant
https://amzn.to/3W4nt45
Institutiones Stili Latini, by Aemilius Sprighetti
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...
The Regional Diversification of Latin 200 BC - AD 600, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3TRGZ2w
An Anthology of Informal Latin, 200 BC–AD 900: Fifty Texts with Translations and Linguistic Commentary, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3gSPOdM
Social Variation and the Latin Language, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3TQ4tVF
Early and Late Latin: Continuity or Change?, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3WcqzDn
Late Latin and Early Romance in Spain and Carolingian France (Arca Classical and Medieval Texts, Papers and Monographs, by Roger Wright
https://amzn.to/3gVkgE0
Breve grammatica storica dell’italiano, by Paolo D’Achille
https://amzn.to/3fcfv8V
De recta Latini Graecique sermonis pronuntiatione dialogus, by Erasmus (1528)
https://www.hs-augsburg.de/~harsch/Ch...
Ecclesiastical Latin Versus Classical Latin, by Raphael Turrigiano:
https://ancientlanguage.com/ecclesias...
History in 3D channel: ROME IN 3D - the detailed reconstruction o...
A.Z. Foreman's channel: "Hath Not a Jew Eyes" (Shakespeare's Merch...
TIMESTAMPS — see notes and further commentary in the pinned comment.
0:00 Intro to the Debate
0:58 Is Ecclesiastical Latin just Mediaeval Latin?
3:35 My course on StoryLearning: Latin Uncovered
5:32 Which sounds sillier: Classical or Ecclesiastical Pronunciation?
6:55 Is Ecclesiastical Pronunciation descended from the Roman Empire's pronunciation?
8:16 How do we know what Classical Latin sounded like?
11:55 The true origin of Ecclesiastical Pronunciation
18:30 How old is Ecclesiastical Pronunciation?
19:50 Phonemic vowel length is part of Ecclesiastical Pronunciation too!
22:35 So which should you learn?!
24:03 Outtakes!
24:59 What are you laughin' at?!
Should you learn Ecclesiastical or Classical Latin? This is a question I am often asked, and it's worth exploring in detail. Related questions include: Is Classical Latin superior to Ecclesiastical Latin? Is Ecclesiastical the same as Mediaeval Latin? Where did the Ecclesiastical Pronunciation come from? Is Ecclesiastical Pronunciation the same as Vulgar Latin? This and more will be answered in this heated debate from the streets of Rome! 🏛️
Take my course LATIN UNCOVERED on StoryLearning, including my original Latin adventure novella "Vir Petasātus" :
https://storylearning.com/PolymathyLuke ⬅️
SEE SOURCES BELOW
Note: the "accents" I am using here in English are merely exaggerated caricatures of a British-type accent and a New York-type accent, but are not attempts at authentic representations of either, and I used for comic purposes only.
🦂 Support my work on Patreon:
Patreon: LukeRanieri
📚 Luke Ranieri Audiobooks:
https://luke-ranieri.myshopify.com
🤠 Take my course LATIN UNCOVERED on StoryLearning, including my original Latin adventure novella "Vir Petasātus"
https://learn.storylearning.com/lu-pr...
🦂 Sign up for my Latin Pronunciation & Conversation series on Patreon:
Patreon: 54058196
☕️ Support my work with PayPal:
https://paypal.me/lukeranieri
Consider joining this channel:
@polymathy_luke
🏛 Latin by the Ranieri-Dowling Method: https://luke-ranieri.myshopify.com/co...
🏺Ancient Greek by the Ranieri-Dowling Method: https://luke-ranieri.myshopify.com/co...
🏛 Ancient Greek in Action · Free Greek Lessons:
Ancient Greek in Action! Ancient Greek Les...
🦂 ScorpioMartianus (my channel for content in Latin, Ancient Greek, & Ancient Egyptian)
scorpiomartianus
🎙 Hundreds of hours of Latin & Greek audio:
https://lukeranieri.com/audio
🌍 polýMATHY website:
http://lukeranieri.com/polymathy/
🌅 polýMATHY on Instagram:
Instagram: lukeranieri
🦁 Legio XIII Latin Language Podcast:
legioxiii
👕 Merch:
https://teespring.com/stores/scorpiom...
🦂 https://www.ScorpioMartianus.com
🦅 https://www.LukeRanieri.com
📖 My book Ranieri Reverse Recall on Amazon:
http://amzn.to/2nVUfqd
Intro and outro music: Overture of Die Zauberflöte (The Magic Flute) by Mozart
#latin #linguistics #debate
SOURCES
Vox Latina, by W. Sidney Allen
https://amzn.to/3WdPxSY
The Pronunciation of Greek and Latin, Edgar Howard Sturtevant
https://amzn.to/3W4nt45
Institutiones Stili Latini, by Aemilius Sprighetti
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...
The Regional Diversification of Latin 200 BC - AD 600, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3TRGZ2w
An Anthology of Informal Latin, 200 BC–AD 900: Fifty Texts with Translations and Linguistic Commentary, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3gSPOdM
Social Variation and the Latin Language, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3TQ4tVF
Early and Late Latin: Continuity or Change?, by JN Adams
https://amzn.to/3WcqzDn
Late Latin and Early Romance in Spain and Carolingian France (Arca Classical and Medieval Texts, Papers and Monographs, by Roger Wright
https://amzn.to/3gVkgE0
Breve grammatica storica dell’italiano, by Paolo D’Achille
https://amzn.to/3fcfv8V
De recta Latini Graecique sermonis pronuntiatione dialogus, by Erasmus (1528)
https://www.hs-augsburg.de/~harsch/Ch...
Ecclesiastical Latin Versus Classical Latin, by Raphael Turrigiano:
https://ancientlanguage.com/ecclesias...
History in 3D channel: ROME IN 3D - the detailed reconstruction o...
A.Z. Foreman's channel: "Hath Not a Jew Eyes" (Shakespeare's Merch...
TIMESTAMPS — see notes and further commentary in the pinned comment.
0:00 Intro to the Debate
0:58 Is Ecclesiastical Latin just Mediaeval Latin?
3:35 My course on StoryLearning: Latin Uncovered
5:32 Which sounds sillier: Classical or Ecclesiastical Pronunciation?
6:55 Is Ecclesiastical Pronunciation descended from the Roman Empire's pronunciation?
8:16 How do we know what Classical Latin sounded like?
11:55 The true origin of Ecclesiastical Pronunciation
18:30 How old is Ecclesiastical Pronunciation?
19:50 Phonemic vowel length is part of Ecclesiastical Pronunciation too!
22:35 So which should you learn?!
24:03 Outtakes!
24:59 What are you laughin' at?!
Available exclusively on the StoryLearning platform, I’ve written an original Latin novella about a daring archaeologist, a genius physicist, and a tremulous philologist who are 21st century explorers and fluent Latin speakers, on a quest for a lost relic from the Roman Empire.
This novella forms the core of my course on StoryLearning: Latin Uncovered "Vir Petasātus" — an exciting adventure that immerses you in the idiom of modern-day Latin speakers, and with a mystery that’ll keep you guessing right up to the end.
There are a lot of ways to learn Latin out there, and you know I espouse many of them, so whom is this course for, and what makes it different?
Well, one can learn with a teacher in a classroom, but others work better as autodidacts and prefer to study solo. My StoryLearning course gives the best of both worlds: you get hours of video instruction from me, where I teach you the grammar, vocabulary, how to conjugate verbs, how to decline nouns, as well as the most detailed pronunciation guide I’ve ever put together, along with lots of helpful hints on Latin syntax and idiom — all the things you might get in a classroom, but you go at your own pace, since you don’t have to schedule with any instructors or other students. Thus you get the excitement and personal adventure of learning the language on your own, with all the video lessons you need to master the basics.
As for the novella, it’s not a graded reader, and it’s like that by design, because I wanted to challenge you with a real adventure story from the very first sentence. Nevertheless, each chapter has detailed explanations of all the new vocabulary, how all the grammar works, and a full English translation, so you’ll never get lost.
And naturally, the audio of the story is in both Classical and Ecclesiastical Pronunciation, and I teach you how to do both, so whichever you prefer is the one you’ll be able to learn.
NOTES & FURTHER COMMENTARY
The line "have you got your lions crossed" at 7:38 is a reference to Nathan Lane's portrayal of the character Timon in "The Lion King," who has an accent similar to the one I am imitating here. This is also a reference to Erasmus's dialogue "De recta Latini Graecique sermonis pronuntiatione" where the Bear educates the Lion on the correct ancient pronunciation of Latin and Greek. This is referred to more explicitly at 18:20.
The line "if raisins/reasons were as plentiful as blackberries" at 11:40 is a reference to this: https://internetshakespeare.uvic.ca/Library/SLT/literature/language/pronunciation.html The comment about "what" is referring to the fact that I started pronouncing a voiceless-w for "wh" in English once I began practicing Shakespearean Pronunciation.
The Arnold Schwarzenegger impression is borrowed lovingly from comedian Jim Gaffigan.
Foreigners in Italy who ask "How old are you?" often mispronounce "Quanti anni hai?" as "Quanti ani hai?" meaning "How many anuses do you have?" This underlines the non-negotiable importance of geminated consonants in Italian and Latin, as well as phonemic vowel length in the latter.