Today is November 16, 2025, I come to check this bet ten years ago.

Can the forum bring these  people back together again 10 year later now?

When every man and his dog has a say, you get nothing done. That is democracy.

The United States is full of people like this woman, with full self-confidence of he/she is talking about and yet times after times they proved to be wrong.

2025 and Eric is spot on on Ukraine

The lady used Burma and Ukraine as her arguments, just look at these where are the two countries right now.

Eric X Li is my hero, a candle in the darkness that is the false claims of ideological Democracy, and the pain and misery that it has caused amongst millions of people.

Eric is very fond of gambling. Just as the ten-year bet was about to expire, we witnessed China becoming increasingly powerful and the United States becoming increasingly chaotic. I can't imagine that three consecutive US presidents were held by two eighty-year-old men. And the United States is becoming increasingly closed-off.

In Hong Kong, there's a group of families that depends on US' donation to support themselves.  Those people works in institutions where they work as job trainers.  There's, however, an extra thing they do.  They would go to those Umbrella movements during work hours and get paid a monthly salary for it.

Is my point that they are traitors?  Not really, but they're certainly influenced by who's supporting them and their families.  
This is merely one example that raises the question whether democracy can be bought using money.  Do people really have rights? or the people with money have rights?

Yet you nailed it, Eric.

There are two notions posited by the proponents of democracy being universal:

1) People have higher needs and wants and that they could be acquired by having a democratic system

2) Democracy is not the existence of just elections, but the existence of freedoms, rights, and checks and balances

It has been demonstrated again and again in history that democracy is not a prerequisite for any of these.

Higher order needs are subjective to everyone. But for example let's use the need to speak one's mind on anything - a democracy is not required for that need to be satisfied. Freedom of religion, abolition of slavery, women's rights, checks, balances, and a true level of autonomy were all achieved under meritocracies and even dictatorships.

One perfect example would be Achaemenid Persia. Though it was a dictatorship, it had the kind of human rights, anti-slavery mentality, and equality for women that would humble Athens, the birth place of democracy.

There is also this idea that democracy is needed for liberalizing the economy. When China liberalizes its economy, it is in no one becoming democratic or Western nor will it require democracy to further liberalize its economy. Rather, China is becoming more authentically-Chinese by liberalizing. A proto-capitalist and free market economy with corporations and private ownership and assumption of profits and risk are the defining characteristics of pre-Qing Chinese economic systems.

Seems to be an unfair debate, two pro- democracy versus one pro-socialism.

It is 2023 now. Eric and Paula’s bets on Burma and Ukraine are a clear demonstration of why democracy should never be considered as universal.
Certainly adore Eric’s composure and eloquence.

i really like eric li's presentations.

Eric is smarter than all of them put together.

"Protection of human right by democracy". Almost 5 years later, the world is in COVID-19 pandemic, as the US and West Europe combined have the most death by far, what about protection of human lives? Do you admit that human lives is also human right?

2023 Eric win

Those who argue for democracy simply treats democracy as a region. It is the same freedom and human rights. They are all treated as regions. For a region, there is no good or bad; you have to take it. That is, region means dictatorship.

Hahahaha, all those idiots who argued against Eric about how West and the Democracy’s strength is the “peaceful change” are probably regretting it now. Democracy has only made society worse and divided more than ever, and more violent as time goes on. People are now so divided they would rather murder each other than hearing each other.

funny. I just wanna know how those guys think after they saw during this pandemic.