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This Physicist May Have Just Solved Quantum Gravity

Curt Jaimungal

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This is a breaking podcast. We're premiering a new paradigm for quantizing 4D gravity here first, without strings. Neil Turok — inaugural Higgs Chair at Edinburgh, former director of Perimeter Institute, and 2026 Fellow of the Royal Society — believes quantum gravity may not require strings, extra dimensions, or a multiverse. The key: a 1970s theory called quadratic gravity, long abandoned over two seemingly fatal problems. Turok and Bateman argue both problems dissolve — one by reinterpreting a classical instability as ordinary gravitational expansion, the other by a subtle tweak to the Born rule that allows quantum states of negative norm without ever producing negative probabilities. One quiet assumption, Turok argues, underpins decades of string theory's necessity. Drop it, and the whole case for a multiverse unravels. Neil graciously gave me a sneak peek at his and his PhD student Sam Bateman's new research. Bleeding edge! I hope you enjoy.

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00:00 - Quadratic Gravity Emergence
00:05:03 - Renormalization and Asymptotic Freedom
00:10:57 - Ghosts and Krein Spaces
00:16:00 - Generalizing the Born Rule
00:23:27 - Ostrogradsky Instability Reinterpreted
00:31:29 - UV Completeness and QCD
00:38:21 - Higgs Compositeness and Hierarchy
00:43:58 - CPT Symmetric Universe Minimalism
00:52:54 - The 36 Fields Mystery
01:00:10 - Orthodoxy vs. Revolutionary Ideas
01:06:39 - Gravitational Entropy and Smoothness
01:16:14 - Multiverse Measure Problem
01:23:05 - Theoretical Physics Health
01:30:07 - Sam Bateman’s Breakthrough
01:43:33 - Philosophy of Cosmology

LINKS MENTIONED:
Neil's Papers: https://inspirehep.net/authors/985402
Renormalization of Higher-Derivative Quantum Gravity [Paper]: https://journals.aps.org/prd/abstract...
Quadratic Gravity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrat...
Asymptotic Freedom in Higher-Derivative Quantum Gravity [Paper]: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science...
Ostrogradsky's Theorem: http://www.scholarpedia.org/article/O...
Krein Space: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indefin...
CPT-Symmetric Universe [Paper]: https://arxiv.org/abs/1803.08928
Pathologies of Dimension-Zero Scalar Fields [Paper]: https://arxiv.org/abs/2603.05683
No-Ghost Theorem for Pais-Uhlenbeck Oscillator [Paper]: https://arxiv.org/abs/0706.0207
Cancelling the Vacuum Energy [Paper]: https://arxiv.org/abs/2110.06258
Gravitational Entropy [Paper]: https://arxiv.org/abs/2201.07279
Neil's Lecture: https://pirsa.org/15100070

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Jacob Barandes [TOE]: Harvard Scientist: "There is No Quantum Mu...
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Harvey Friedman [TOE]: The Genius Who Invented Reverse Mathematics
Scott Aaronson [TOE]: Scott Aaronson: The Greatest Unsolved Prob...
David Deutsch [TOE]: The Multiverse May Be Real | David Deutsch
Peter Woit & Joseph Conlon [TOE]: String Theory's Biggest Critic Debates Str...

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20 Comments

@TheoriesofEverything Creator 3 months ago (edited) Pinned

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@Lasselucidora 3 months ago

Of all the scientists I do not understand, I like most of all to not understand Neil Turok.

@jeremytitus9519 3 months ago

Disappointing absence of dinosaur combat.

@quantumwormholes8246 2 months ago

19:45 - "You make one false move in theoretical physics and you are totally wrong." I'm afraid this describes most of the late 20th century physics.

@johnnyespinoza8 3 months ago

One of the many reasons I follow Curt’s TOE is because the conversations are always top notch. This one in particular stands out. I’m just a layman, an engineer passionate about Mathematics and Physics. To say I was able to comprehend 0.5% it would be an overstatement. However, many of the topics covered by the professor are not absolutely unknown to me. This conversation is as ground breaking as it gets! Forward thinking! That’s what makes science progress! Thank You Curt!

@ThegreatINFORMER 1 month ago

The professor has a vast knowledge on the topic and you were asking the perfect questions that we all wants to hear. The most perfect video I have ever seen!! Thanks Prof. and thanks Curt

@matteobonan6042 1 month ago

If only there were more directors like him. I liked his way of thinking, questioning everything, inflation, and the strings that he never mentioned, but he rightly used the term "orthodoxy." I would like this interview to be listened to by the directors of Italian universities, especially by those who propose calls for researchers and include string theory among the topics. The job of a physicist is to question everything, especially one's own thinking. This is the only way to make progress, and the stagnation in research demonstrates this. When he mentioned the multiverse and its madness, it was met with a standing ovation.

@LordCaptainFather 3 months ago

Always great when Kurt interviews leaders in a verified field, with mathematically robust frameworks.

@BalazsAlexa 3 months ago

Love this! Love how 50 thousand people are excited about this and watching. Wish it was more, but not too bad compared to most of humanity's history! Thank you Curt for creating this channel!

@RossGayTM 4 weeks ago

It's clear that you are both enjoying this conversation immensely. It's fun to watch and very enlightening!

@lucasviniciusnascimentobar9551 3 months ago

I’m just a lay person. I can’t say I understand everything being said, however, I love the fact that this interviewer brings the things being said to a level that can be comprehensive even though it is complex nonetheless. Thank you for this amazing interview on a groundbreaking paper!

@zetristan4525 3 months ago

They didn't teach me this in ostrogradschool

@vdlzts. 3 months ago

"Ultimately, Physics is about information".
On the right mind, this idea on it's own turns all knowledge into re-questioning.
So important, yet so hard to actually "host" the implicances.

@DrDoeg 3 months ago

I’m a physicist an I learn a LOT from these podcasts

@Cloudinthesky777 3 months ago

I find Neil Turok always very creative, intelligent and daring, as well as progressive! What ever he brings up it is always highly interesting.
Thanks Curt, Neil Turok!

@maestroarabiya7915 3 months ago

Thanks Neil and Curt
Extraordinaire Thank you

@swifttiger5546 3 months ago

Wow, so juicy, exciting! The dialogical format here is perfect, the joy of discovery and ideas suffusing it throughout. Yay and thank you both.

@Deliaszek 3 months ago (edited)

A note to Neil G. Turok.
The reinterpretation that the Ostrogradsky instability is the expansion is the part that stays with me. It made
me wonder whether the ghost and its cure are the same object: the degeneracy that makes the theory renormalizable is also where the unstable mode lives. I've been quietly developing a small discrete system where that's exact. The unstable element is literally its own regulator, and the Krein trace-positivity isn't imposed, it falls out automatically once you count states instead of squaring amplitudes. Different road, maybe the same river.
I'd be glad to show you the construction if you're ever curious.

@taylortails 3 months ago

Keep up the good work Curt and Neil!

@paulkohl9267 3 months ago

Krein space and the projection opertator view of Relativistic QM blows my mind. It is a beautiful and significant result. Thank you Curt and Neal for this highly interesting video.